come up with skill ideas for the sniper hero

There isn't a hero page for the sniper, so I'll post here. I know he's being remade.

The sniper should play differently than the BGH, but there are problems. Range, something that makes sense on the sniper, is already on the BGH.

In addition, the snipers skill set is flawed. Snipe, a nuke, is not fitted to the AGI nature of the sniper especially as the opponent can swap out of it both before and when it fires (making it useless). Flare is not the most useful move. And explosive ammunition looks cool, but would probably make more sense as a 100% chance with less effects.

I'm worried the sniper is lacking. He needs an ability that allows him to attack without them simply running away or forces his enemy to swap, this could be a stun, slow, or other debuff (hex, ect). He currently has a decent escape and interesting move called power slide, this should definitly stay, and perhaps the slow/stun/debuff could be added to the first attack after it effect. Perhaps a good move for the sniper would be a sort of ghillie suit that would give him a windwalk, except at extremely reduced speed. That leaves a reason for the enemy to run, the sniper needs some good damage, while explosive bullets has a cool animation a better move would be non-passive and more interesting.

Power slide, Bengal and I have discussed and decidedly think it's balanced. With an 8 second cooldown, decent divine damage bonus, and guaranteed invulnerability, it gives sniper a good fighting chance.

There is a slight difference in BGH and Sniper when it comes to range; Sniper is blessed with 650 from the get-go, whereas BGH has to get 4 levels of U-shells before he reaches his peak of 700. This means Sniper has a huge early game advantage, esp with his attack animation, which is also why he starts out with very low base damage.

Giving your hero some thought though, I do agree that he doesn't have the same level of late game ownage like BGH, Troll, or some of the agi heroes do. We DO NOT think we should replace snipe, however. Snipe IS a really good ability, and with 20 sec cd, 2500 range and a decent amount of damage, Sharp shooter can become very game-controlling if he ganks properly. We do aim to rework snipe so it's not simple 3-second cast time storm bolt though; we're making it so that when you cast snipe you get a small targeting beacon in which you have to AIM it on the hero exactly right (like as if you were actually aiming), and upon success it will fire a shot and deal instant damage on the target. If you miss however, you have to try again when your cooldown is up again. We may make this spell do more damage depending on the difficulty of pulling the spell off.

We discussed the issue of flare, and I'm sort've "meh" about it. What we were planning is making flare much better; if you flare an area, you get bonus damage and your spells all do increased damage; for example, your exploding bullets have a much higher chance of procing, your slide will do more damage, and snipe will be easier to pull off (bigger targeting circle).

While he doesn't have the instant dps of some of the other agi heroes, he is still a lot of fun to play and I don't know if we're designing him to be the ultimate carry.

Your idea of snipe sounds interesting, at present its quite silly because they just wait 2.5 seconds, swap, make me retarget, repeat.

I don't think sniper should be the ultimate carry, but explosive bullets being passive does make him quite boring.

Most good heroes have at least one ability, a stun or very powerful nuke, a serious debuff, that compels his opponent to swap either to dispell it or to doge it. This gives the hero much more depth, forcing him to try to get his opponent to swap.

The same ability I mentioned above should be helpful in killing the hero (if it hits) and through reduced MS, or disable allow the hero do some damage. The sniper has no such move, so when fighting him an enemy simply runs away. Heroes who do not have that generally have some sort of chase mechanism, fire panda has a blinkstrike, bengal has a hook, etc. The only way I can see the sniper getting a kill, is showing up right behind the enemy hero at the snipers tower, then attacking him as he runs from the tower past the sniper and out of range.

Agil heroes sacrifice a lot in terms of suvivability with the hope of being late game powerhouses, the sniper does not become one.

You did not respond to my guillie suit idea of a -90%ms WW, also perhaps it could dispell when hostiles get too close and recognize him, sort of like tree's invisbility in dota.

Another idea that just occured to me, which is probably terrible, but cool is this: The snipers actual attack could be a like 700 range storm bolt with no stun that has a 1 sec casting time. So easily dogeable, high damage, super low attack speed, and casting time to do it.

i'm open to more suggestions.

I do not think we will improve power slide anymore than it already is though; and adding a windwalk invis WITH powerslide is too much for one hero.

I probably misled you, I agree powerslide is good as is. If you look at my last post, I'm dicussing giving him some sort of slow/trap/stun or chase mechanism.

It would not be windwalk, because it would dispell if enemy units got within say 300 range and would slow the sniper down to ridiculously slow move speed.

My other point was explosive bullets, it looks cool, but is *really* boring.

what if, as part of the channeling effect, the sniper becomes invis until the shot fires? It's not overpowered because he can't move while invis, it adds a bit in terms of not being stunned/hexed while casting, it lets you shoot without an opponent knowing (sometimes), and it might give you an excuse to bump the casting time up without making the move bad.

snipe is being totally reworked to be really cool and fast. so no worries there.

what kind of 'chase mechanism' do you mean?

idk, i need to get to sleep for my final tomorrow, but just off the top of my head. Maybe something along the lines of "the sniper lowers his weapon and dashes towards the target (aoe/unit idk)." and maybe doing something like a tackle.

thats probably a terrible idea, but you know what a chase mechanism is, moves that prevent the enemy from walking away at will or help you travel fast enough to both keep up and attack him, or even hook like moves.

There's always the classic "hamstring" snipe, but that always seemed more of an archer type thing to me.

Perhaps a move that increases his range by a lot for the duration?

Sentry wards would be a good substitute for flare, especially if the wards see as flying. Not too many heros have invis so it shouldn't be game-breaking.

shit you might be on to something, super increased range/damage/whatnot but he cant move, that would be interesting. It wouldnt particularly help with chasing, but It would fit into his theme and let him get kills?

maybe a Tiny-type move, where he passively lowers atkspeed and movespeed to increase damage?

no that makes it a passive :-(

It would probably make sense as a active toggle that you can activate instantly but to turn off you have to channel for a couple secs.

we'll remake him and make him good.